Eric
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Post by Eric on Jan 27, 2014 23:43:38 GMT -5
I voted for Revenge of the Sith as the least bad of the three horrible, godawful prequels. Note "least bad" as opposed to "good"
Sure it's half boring crap of people walking up and down hallways and talking, but the mustafar battle is alright, even if it's horribly long and drawn out...so I guess that's a plus
And after you have absolutely horrible movies like the Phantom Menace & Attack of the Clones, I don't think it's possible for it to be any worse
So what say you? What's your opinion for the least bad "Star Wars" prequel?
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Post by zachangel on Jan 29, 2014 20:55:46 GMT -5
Phantom Menace was a god-awful movie, but Liam Neeson's character of Quigon-Jin was great.
Attack of the Clones was the best movie of the three.
Revenge of the Sith was not done as well as it should have been, in part because the younger Obi-Wan was miscast.
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Post by Sam Whitfield on Feb 1, 2014 2:24:34 GMT -5
I actually liked Phantom but I think that's only because Liam Neeson was in it. I feel like they killed his character off too soon! There could've been A really good story arc between him, obi wan, and Annikan.
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Eric
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Post by Eric on Feb 1, 2014 3:26:26 GMT -5
Maybe one of these days I'll go I to detail why I felt like these movies are all horrible, but I probably won't since nobody cares, and it'll probably come across to you guys as an old guy waving his cane yelling through his gums about whatnot..
Also it's quite a long list of reasons.
And I guess I agree that Liam did okay for the absolute shlock he was given but that's about as far as I'm willing to go in terms of compliments for these horrid atrocities
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Post by Sam Whitfield on Feb 1, 2014 12:08:44 GMT -5
Maybe one of these days I'll go I to detail why I felt like these movies are all horrible, but I probably won't since nobody cares, and it'll probably come across to you guys as an old guy waving his cane yelling through his gums about whatnot.. Also it's quite a long list of reasons. And I guess I agree that Liam did okay for the absolute shlock he was given but that's about as far as I'm willing to go in terms of compliments for these horrid atrocities Seeing as how you're not an old guy, that should be hilarious lol!
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Eric
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Post by Eric on Feb 1, 2014 18:58:45 GMT -5
Sam Whitfield To be fair, I hate the subsequent trashed releases of "Star Wars", "Empire" and "Jedi" (starting in 97, then again in 04, 06, and 12) about as much as I do the fact that no matter how hard I wish them away, or ignore their existence, the prequels will always exist. I'm not sure which one I find more offensive. Almost everything about those special editions is dumb and wrong, and in a lot of cases is a sign of the massive problems to come in the prequels For example, the scene before the Mos Eisley Cantina in "Star Wars", we see an exterior shot of the city, with modest amount of activity, but in the special editions, they just pack as much unnnecessary crap into every f*cking shot. That's just one example, but another is the primary colors (especially in the 97 special edition) are all jacked up. The colors all look off, the lightsabers look awful (Vader's is basically pink), and the new CG shots are absolutely ugly and unnecessary. I'm not against use of CG, but the way it was used (that is to say, large parts of this movie were filmed in front of a green screen, as opposed to shooting on location) The result might look crisp, but it also looks sterile and fake, and is really jarring and distracting. That doesn't even begin to touch the problems with the plot structure, the cardboard, and 1 dimensional characters, godawful dialogue, sloppy and rushed writing, etc (I joked, when the Phantom Menace was in 3D, that this was the only way that anything in that movie would be three dimensional) The only time I ever sympathize with a character in the prequels is when that robot (whatever its name is, nobody cares) says Padme has lost the will to live. After being tricked twice into thinking that movies might be good (Phantom Menace & Clones), and coming (because i felt obligated) to Sith, I felt like i lost the will to live, too.
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Post by zachangel on Feb 2, 2014 18:12:25 GMT -5
Keep in mind that George Lucas has always been a terrible script writer and all of the Star Wars movies are sloppy. None of them have a sharp script, and the acting is very uneven. Some of the acting is good (Liam Neeson, Harrison Ford, Alec Guinness, even Frank Oz as the voice of Yoda) but some of the acting is absolutely horrific (Mark Hamill, Jake Lloyd). Some of the story elements are good and some are not so great, and clearly made up along the way. Personally, I think it's selective memory (or something of that nature) to lionize the first three but trash the second three. I'm glad Lucas will have very little do with the next three. He's not consistent.
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Eric
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Post by Eric on Feb 4, 2014 21:37:46 GMT -5
I don't think so, Zach. The first three work well as films, and as part of a trilogy/arc, whereas everything in the prequels really doesn't. (I'll begrudgingly include Jedi, but I do so acknowledging it's the weakest of the three for reasons I'll go into later)
I think we can agree though that George Lucas is the problem, and even though I really wish these next movies didn't exist, getting Lucas out of this was probably the best thing they could have done. I only regret that his decision to sell Lucasfilms came about 20 years too late.
The first three work as both stand-alone-pieces, and as parts of a larger trilogy. They're very much homages to the Saturday morning serials that George grew up watching & loved. They contain a tight and well written story, with snappy and clever dialogue, and a cast of clearly defined characters, with clearly-defined motives. These characters all portray classic archetypes dating back to forever ago.
As for the dialogue being cheesy at points, maybe, but nothing comparable to the absolute crap that made it into the prequels ('I hate sand' 'Anakin you're breaking my heart' "it's only because i'm SO in love with you/so love has blinded you?" Say what you will about the original three, but nothing this embarrassing made it into Star Wars, Empire, or Jedi. What made Star Wars and Empire good was that Lucas had people helping him re-write the scripts constantly, or in the case of Irvin Kershner, interacting with the actors, re-writing whole scenes right on the set. The point is, Lucas wanted to have complete control over his movies again, so he took back over on Jedi, but still allowed for Lawrence Kasdan to re-write parts of the script. I imagine the only reason Jedi is as good as it is, can be attributed to the input that Kasdan had. That being said, little problems that we would see in the prequels (and the horrid special editions) begin to manifest themselves in Jedi, but in a much much less egregious form.
The problem with the prequels is Lucas had nobody there to tell him no, or tell him that his ideas need work, or his script is complete schlock. The result is a sloppily written script that makes absolutely no sense, with wooden, one-dimensional characters, who lack common sense, or the ability to come to conclusions that any non-idiot would come to.
Anyway, this has been a long post, and I know that was very general but I'm more than happy to list my specific grievances with the prequels, because I think pretty much everything in them is wrong.
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Post by zachangel on Feb 4, 2014 21:48:11 GMT -5
I really don't remember enough to comment in detail. What you say is probably reasonable. I have read that a lot of changes were made to the original plan along the way. For example, the original idea of "there is another" had nothing to do with Leia, who was originally not supposed to be Luke's sister. That sort of thing was added when it was decided there would be not as many movies as originally planned, or some such. So, if you really look at the original storyline, it has a sloppiness to it, because although what's there has become a classic, it's not really organized as tightly as it could have been or was originally intended to be. The first and third movies were too much "the good guys win" tales, with the middle one being the only standout with dark overtones. Hamill was such an embarrassingly piss poor actor.
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